Tweets Between

GeorgeMonbiot & leashless

copy & paste the link below to share this exact convo with others!

(click in the box above & hold CTRL + C to copy, then use CTRL + V to paste!)

Newest to Oldest | Oldest to Newest

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Another thing that makes me wonder what u were doing at #DarkMountain festival. Pentagon consultant, reporting on protest groups

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 12:19:59 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless ... and Trident enthusiast. @paulkingsnorth - is this guy really an ally of yours?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 12:21:05 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @inflector @leashless Yeah, right.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 12:28:20 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    . @leashless which explains your work for the Pentagon?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 12:41:49 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    . @leashless My concern about what you're up to long pre-dates your tweet about Trident. Pentagon consultant, reporting on protest groups.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:00:07 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @ciphergoth @leashless Billed at DarkMountain as consulting the Pentagon about protest groups. He didn't dispute the billing.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:09:07 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @dougald @ciphergoth @leashless You got the recording?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:14:43 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @dougald @ciphergoth @leashless Will certainly consider possibility. It was in the intro to him on stage. I responded with shock at time.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:22:29 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @dougald @ciphergoth @leashless I'm not suggesting he's a spy, but that I had doubts about which side he was on.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:28:09 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @ciphergoth @dougald @leashless Not in the least. But you can understand my concern, no?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:28:42 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @dougald @ciphergoth @leashless The way I remember it, it was about consulting Pentagon on protest groups.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:31:20 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    RT @leashless: .@GeorgeMonbiot I think the United States Energy Security Council which is Pentagon and CIA is our best hope http://t.co/exjz8Ny6

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:47:17 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    RT @leashless: .@GeorgeMonbiot They're a far more credible power group to deliver a global climate stabilization agenda than the UN and similar bodies.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:47:22 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @davidsteven: Unpleasant seeing @GeorgeMonbiot directing 'Pentagon informer' accusations at @leashless - (here's an e.g. of his work http://t.co/nJ3j4afP)

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 13:58:19 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @nraford: A real joke RT @davidsteven: Unpleasant seeing @GeorgeMonbiot directing 'Pentagon informer' accusations at @leashless http://t.co/F91cXzBJ

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:05:13 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @davidsteven: Accusations of this sort could have unpleasant consequences far down the road. I'd really like to see @GeorgeMonbiot back off on this one.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:06:00 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @davidsteven: For a more rational response to the 'who on earth is @leashless?' question than @GeorgeMonbiot 's: http://t.co/q6vfxGfa (by @dougald)

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:17:18 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @geopoetic: @leashless @dougald @georgemonbiot so come on now Vinay: what REALLY happened at Roswell?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:17:29 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    Anyway, @GeorgeMonbiot I can accept that you misheard or misunderstood how I was introduced at Dark Mountain. This creates an issue.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:19:58 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    As somebody who believes in whole-of-society response to poverty and climate, including military at times, I work widely @GeorgeMonbiot

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:20:36 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot Your accusation that I'm an informant for the secret police turns my access to machinery of power from strength to weakness

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:21:35 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot and, of course, once such accusations are made, there's no way to get away from them. So let me say, publicly, this.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:22:10 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot I've worked in a policy capacity wherever I had the opportunity, to take Gandhi's vision _everywhere_. I act with integrity.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:23:13 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot and I'll be sad to see, in future years, people doubt me and my work because you misheard something at Dark Mountain in 2010

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:24:22 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot Your misunderstanding could have been cleared up in 5 minutes for three years, and you chose to carry that paranoia silently

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:25:07 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot I have worked wherever there was a chance to effect real change. I've mostly done it for free, even for US DOD. Volunteered.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:25:53 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot and some of those people (some) are among the finest human beings I've ever had the privilege to know and work alongside of

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:26:35 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot A "progressive or positive force" looks very different in uniform to carrying a black flag: progressives are everywhere.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:27:39 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    RT @leashless: .@GeorgeMonbiot and I'll be sad to see, in future years, people doubt me and my work because you misheard something at Dark Mountain in 2010

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:29:00 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot I understand you walked across the aisle on nuclear power. I did it on military affairs. Realist solidarity is an option.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:29:27 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot I understand the kind of situations which produce this kind of paranoia, and I'm sure that people have it about you too.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:32:46 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot were you bought by the nuclear industry? No, you looked at the data and took an unpopular stance. As did I. Nobody likes it.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 14:34:11 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @davidsteven: Finally from @geopoetic the intro to @leashless that led @georgemonbiot to conclude he was an American informer http://t.co/QU6PmmL9

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 15:50:33 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @kotope: @GeorgeMonbiot / @leashless on #Storify http://t.co/cokibUX0 #darkmountain #trident

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 19:06:57 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@theblacklamp @dougald consider the scenario: if @GeorgeMonbiot's memory was accurate, I'd have been lynched on stage. Nonsensical scenario

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 19:50:16 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot By the way, George, now that it's pretty clear that you made a mistake (nobody else remembers what you remember) say sorry.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:02:01 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot You may disagree with my politics, but you will not characterize me as a spy on your mishearing of another's comment in 2010

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:03:20 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot You've done something wrong here, and it is incumbent upon you to correct it.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:03:54 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless I did not call you a spy. Let's wait until Dougald finds the recording to see how well I remembered it.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:25:15 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot George, if Paul had said what you think he said, there would have been immediate public outcry then-and-there, rightly so.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:42:40 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot and, frankly, it's grossly irresponsible of you to make such accusations without checking your memory first.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:43:29 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot You simply have this wrong. With or without tape, you've made very public, very damaging baseless accusations.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:44:31 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless I was astonished that no one else reacted. Shocked both by what I heard and by lack of audience response.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:44:50 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Well if there's no substance to them, I apologise. But I was quite clear about what I heard.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:45:35 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot whether you originated this error, or Paul did does not matter. What matters is you've repeated it as fact without evidence

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:46:19 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot And rather than asking me, or quietly asking Dougald or Paul, you went public *because I criticised your political position*

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:47:35 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless No - because your response on Trident appeared to confirm what I had heard: that you were too close to the mil-industrial complex

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:49:05 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot When you reach the point of branding your political critics as government spies to invalidate their views, you are done.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:49:26 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot I'm not going to take this to the mat, or put your head on a pole: we all make mistakes. Do please learn from yours.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:50:28 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot A lot of people respect your opinion, you've said some very outlandish things about me and they land where my life is complex

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:51:05 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless I repeat - I did not call you a spy. You accuse me of false accusations then make them yourself.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:51:14 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot Lovins and Fuller both spent *plenty* of time working for US DOD, and we're all much better for it. Don't make it a liability

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:52:07 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot Because if the people with the nukes are going to get the best council they need to be able to clearly hear dissenting voices

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:52:49 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot If you want to call me out on being too close to the military industrial complex, there's a fact-based discussion to be had.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:53:56 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot But making an accusation of this kind based on your memory of what somebody else said about me years ago is not good practice

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:54:44 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless In what sense do you dissent from the nuclear weapons programme if you endorse Trident?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:54:48 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot I accept that you made a mistake here: Twitter's a dangerous medium, being both instant and public. I hope harm's minimal.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:55:24 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless OK, I take that point.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:55:25 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot My views on this are subtle and complex. I want to keep options open for a nuclear MAD on climate in 20 years.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:56:08 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot That addresses a variety of scenarios that most people in the military and in the green movement thing utterly unthinkable.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:56:43 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless I have no idea what that means.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:57:01 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot Somebody has to scout out the genuinely unthinkable looking for non-obvious pathways into hell, early warning of bad errors.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:57:37 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot I.e. Russians swing hard right (see National Bolsheviks) during collapse, choke energy supply. French have subs & reactors.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:58:16 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless And are the aggressors, on current form, not likely to be the US and its allies?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:58:40 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot I don't like that *at all*. But I also don't believe nuclear power is anything other but last resort: proliferation is awful.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:59:14 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Surely you're aware of how our nuclear programme undermines the NPT, and destroys poss of multilateral disarmament?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 20:59:38 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot And, somewhere in that mess of competing futures, I think that nuclear democracies need to defend core Europe a bit longer.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:00:14 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless And others will think they need to defend against us. So no disarmament and ultimate threat remains.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:01:41 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot Nuclear MAD on Climate: stop burning carbon or we'll nuke you. See my 2004 http://t.co/bhdM1v5j

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:03:59 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless I could think of some far more likely scenarios, greatly exacerbated by our possession of nuclear weapons.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:06:37 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot Now, "on current form" is the key phrase here. See http://t.co/CQYXZzbg - they kept this going for 40 years.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:07:00 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot The Policy of Containment is a much better idea for dealing with climate than the CFC ban was. US DOD & China have long view

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:09:00 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Because of climate change's 30 year lag, likelihood of WMD threat to stop a country freeloading looks minute at any time.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:09:35 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot Nobody's ever figured out how to do stepdown from nuclear détente. But a planet full of reactors is a poor start says Lovins

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:12:58 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot however, because of fast-moving nonlinearities (methane/permafrost, say) rapid political escalation remains possible.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:14:23 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot most people approach this stuff from a most-probable perspective. I speculate, look for "most volatile" = where's leverage?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:16:11 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Who are the major climate refuseniks, now and in foreseeable future? The US, of whose nuclear programme Trident is an offshoot.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:16:23 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless I would say that the more the US + allies rely on nuclear weapons, the less amenable they are to negotiation.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:17:53 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot I cultivate a portfolio of scenario work based on "most impact" not "most probable": critical work on many improbable risks

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:20:47 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot the sum of that scenario work: nuclear terrorism, pandemic flu/biowar, global maoism, biometrics+genocide is a lot of change

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:22:42 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Sure. But if averting an improbable risk depends on new nuclear weapons, it makes more probable risks more likely.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:22:43 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot The US is still recovering from 9/11 & Bush presidency. It's also most-likely to ship Hail Mary Pass on solar or thorium.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:23:48 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot That's a calculus between each person and their conscience. You back reactors, I back nuclear democracies. Maybe both wrong.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:25:26 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless It sounds to me as if you're providing the Pentagon with new excuses to maintain its nuclear weapons programme.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:27:59 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot There is zero possibility of the Pentagon giving up its nuclear weapons unless they replace them with something worse, G.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:29:58 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot the American people will not let them give up military preeminence, and they live in a nation with many democratic traits.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:30:42 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless There certainly is if you keep convincing them they face existential risks.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:32:49 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Funny: a moment ago you were telling me how everything could change, in completely unexpected ways ...

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:34:15 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot Consider, if you will http://t.co/qIC1WsqZ which made a lot of US people *extremely* angry. I'm not a flag carrier.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:36:41 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Flag carrying or not is a different issue. I suggest you're forestalling disarmament by feeding the Pentagon new excuses.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:38:58 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot The "Fall of the USSR" was simply a takeover by the KGB. China walks a fine line indeed, Bo Xilai was a proper Maoist.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:39:41 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot and I'm willing to consider, not countenance, but consider Iron Fist solutions to both climate and poverty. See all sides.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:40:31 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @GeorgeMonbiot: Today's column: how we can defeat political corruption of the kind that‚€™s destroying US democracy. http://t.co/WnqaQEum

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:41:52 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless I'm becoming more convinced than b4 that you + your advocacy are exceedingly dangerous, though not for reasons I first thought.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:42:18 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot There's no disarmament. US, China, Russia, Israel totally intransigent on that. India might be too poor, UK/FR too peaceful.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:43:26 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @GeorgeMonbiot: @leashless I'm becoming more convinced than b4 that you + your advocacy are exceedingly dangerous, though not for reasons I first thought.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:44:22 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot Good. There isn't a person alive who knows my work well who does not, at some level, fear what I might bring into the world.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:45:09 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot But we are *shit out of luck* on existing approaches. Only the Naxalites have new political vision, and maybe the Pirates.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:45:56 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot At which point if there is to be a future, it may fall to me or somebody like me to cut through the Gordian Knot for us all.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:46:47 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless That sounds very frightening, for all the wrong reasons.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:50:38 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot There are many sides to my work. I'm not willing to compromise the objective of securing our long term future for anything.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:52:25 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot But somebody has to backstop this whole situation, and it's not within the reach of (say) Jensen: he's not sharp enough.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:53:07 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless This is all beginning to sound quite megalomaniac.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:53:42 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot The outrage is right enough, but I'm not willing to sacrifice our technological potential for a backwards-facing green.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:53:44 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless But you are?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:54:14 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot On current evidence, our planet is has life in the Universe. We have responsibilities. I am serious about protecting Earth.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:56:01 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot Well, as I said, "me or somebody like me." The worse the condition gets, the more the sociopaths and demagogues rise.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:56:52 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot The point I am making is that I am not "nice" and I'm not interested in the traditional rules of engagement. Not at all.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:57:45 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot It's been tried, it's failed. Either the Tech Fix, or some kind of coercive solution becomes likely. Either works for me.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:58:59 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @solar_bud @leashless The point is that the approach I'm criticising encourages proliferation.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:59:09 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Jeez. I‚€™m happy to accept your assurance that my initial concern was wrong. But what you have told me since seems even worse.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 21:59:58 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot I'm a fairly credible Bond Villain, George. I'm playing nice *for now* because that seems most likely to keep us all alive.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:00:46 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot But if somebody rolled out a credible and basically human ecological fascism, I'd very seriously consider helping out.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:01:20 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot What makes me who (and what) I am is that I'm willing to look at those contingencies right in the face, and deal with them.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:02:06 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    RT @leashless: .@GeorgeMonbiot But if somebody rolled out a credible and basically human ecological fascism, I'd very seriously consider helping out.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:02:34 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot Yes, I wasn't expecting or asking that you like me or approve of my work. But let the charges actually fit the crime, please

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:04:12 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Or make them far worse and far more likely, by encouraging nuclear proliferation and ramping up unlikely threats.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:04:27 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    RT @leashless: .@GeorgeMonbiot Good. There isn't a person alive who knows my work well who does not, at some level, fear what I might bring into the world.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:06:08 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    RT @leashless: .@GeorgeMonbiot At which point if there is to be a future, it may fall to me or somebody like me to cut through the Gordian Knot for us all.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:06:13 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot nuclear weapons are really hard to use, and not all that dangerous in ones and twos. 20m a year die of poverty, nuke does 1m.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:06:34 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot When I'm in activist mode, I use the term "economic genocide" and I well-understand the Naxalite's math. *However*!

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:07:37 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot I also well-understand the Western Capitalist perspective that only Progress can feed 7bn people, and Green Progress is near.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:08:27 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot In the absence of a clear shooting solutions, I'm building tools (http://t.co/52e84UQ4, http://t.co/qxDOKl9i)

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:09:24 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot The objective being to give as many people as possible the best chance of survival in a hard eco/system crash event, or war.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:10:11 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Oh. Silly me. That's just fine then.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:11:18 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot I do not take arms against the economic genocide because it may save more than it kills in the long view. Can you see me now?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:11:37 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot I'm a sociopath. My father was a psychopath. I think about mortality much as an epidemiologist does. I do not flinch.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:14:07 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Oh I can. Really I can.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:14:23 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot By being self-aware, and by directing my energy into good works and good causes, I hope to overcome the risks of that brain.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:15:08 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless Well I'm glad you're straight about it. But I sure as heck don't want to follow you over that cliff.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:15:27 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    RT @leashless: @GeorgeMonbiot I'm a sociopath. My father was a psychopath. I think about mortality much as an epidemiologist does. I do not flinch.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:15:30 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot But I have a brutal-and-continual awareness of the death toll of this system on my people, the poor, and I wait for change.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:17:09 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless It's my bedtime now, but thank you for an enlightening, if horrifying, explanation of your position.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:17:39 +0000)

  • @GeorgeMonbiot said:

    @leashless OK, one last one then. Who says they're your people? You or them?

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:18:44 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot We need a mixed spectrum of responses. Dire military people take my perspective on board: don't fight the poor, you will lose

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:19:35 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot So by representing a certain extreme (in many arenas) I'm making space for a whole bunch of other options to be examined.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:20:30 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    .@GeorgeMonbiot I'm an Indian, George. My father's family are quite middle class, but our cousins put bricks on their chapatis to stop rats.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:23:13 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot One person dies of poverty (water, vaccines, food etc) every second http://t.co/e77k38Ok I hear that tick every day.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:26:34 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot If you want to talk about horror, try Capitalism. But, right now, we don't seem to have better alternatives. I am trying.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:27:20 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @cascio: @leashless @GeorgeMonbiot Vinay, you‚€™re a living Overton Window.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:28:17 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @Grimeandreason: Been loving the @leashless @GeorgeMonbiot convo today. Can appreciate both sides perspective. Scary or not, I value the honesty involved.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:29:18 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @Grimeandreason @GeorgeMonbiot yes, let me second that. Good talking with you today, George, misunderstandings aside. Be well.

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:30:12 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @crisbennett: @leashless @GeorgeMonbiot The sad point we've come to: the last pragmatic options standing are indifferentism or eco-terrorism

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:37:48 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    RT @smarimc: @frabcus @GeorgeMonbiot @leashless The correct tool for this is https://t.co/U44qFd2W -- which creates an mbox!

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:37:54 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    Great! http://t.co/6ugQmpnC is a good, usable record of the conversation with @GeorgeMonbiot via _garrilla Tx

    (On: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 22:46:34 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot btw, you may find http://t.co/nUDMvtdR interesting - the 10m "highlights" on #Occupy etc.

    (On: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 21:10:55 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot In particular, the defn of 1% *within* the rich nations completely distorts that the "99%" are within the top 2% globally.

    (On: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 21:15:48 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot Politics in these terms, simply ignoring the nation state for the most part, factors out most of the hard problems easily.

    (On: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 21:19:06 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot The results you get from a "flat" geography (non-nation state) focused on supply chains break Colonialist mythology totally

    (On: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 21:20:02 +0000)

  • @leashless said:

    @GeorgeMonbiot anyway, that's a pretty good 10 minutes if you're interested in poking around in my conclusions. Enjoy.

    (On: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 21:21:28 +0000)